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BBT Ep. 8: Victoria Moll - Getting Into Medical Coding

May 31, 202333 min read

In this episode we hear from special guest Victoria Moll on how she got into medical coding.

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Welcome to episode eight of The Better Billing Today podcast. I'm your host, Adam Welchel, and this podcast is dedicated to our practice owners and clinic owner operators who are doing their best to improve the patient financial experience, streamline their systems, and improve their cash flow. On this episode, we're going to talk about the increasing demand for medical coders and billers, the Bureau of Labor Statistics and the American Academy Professional coders have both released articles that we've.

Added to the show notes that there's an increasing demand for this profession. In fact, they believe that 37,000 jobs will be added to this industry in the next 10 years. So we've invited Victoria Mall, a special guest on this show to share some of the resources that she's created for those that are breaking into medical coding as a new profession, or if you're an existing medical coder and you need to re-certify or increase your skillset, she has some resources for you.

So let's go to that interview.

All right, and on this part of our show, we have a special guest, Victoria Moll with Contempo Coding. Welcome to the show, Victoria.

Hi. I am really excited to be here today and talk to you guys about some of the things that are going on in my industry, medical billing and coding, especially on the education specter of things.

Yeah. Thank you for having me on. Great. Yeah.

And on that note, I love what you're doing with YouTube videos and the things that you're putting out there because you're giving a lot of resources for our audience and their staff. And my staff. Tell me about this journey that you've made from the medical billing and coding profession to what you're doing on YouTube and what does your audience why do they come to you?

It's funny when I. Started out in medical billing and coding, I wanted to be like, so behind the scenes, like I'm just like, oh, this is a job where they say you can work from home. I'm just gonna do this and I'm gonna be the introvert and work from home and just have everyone leave me alone.

But I finished up my training program through a local community college, wound up getting an internship at the local hospital, was hired off my internship, liked working with the other people, and I honestly don't think I've worked much. Remote work throughout my career, maybe like 10% of it, I would say has been remote work.

But yeah, it was interesting when I finished my program at the hosp and started working at the hospital, they said, Hey, this was the era of private practices. A lot of them being bought up by the hospitals, so they needed people like crazy. And so they brought me on and they said, Hey, now we need some certified coders.

We're gonna bring in a licensed instructor and we'll pay for you to all become certified coders as long as you pass your certification exam. So I thought, oh, this is great. Now the curriculum that has been provided for medical coders over the years hasn't been fantastic. And back then it was it wasn't much, it was like PowerPoint slides.

So I'm sitting here in a room full of other people learning to become certified coders. And the instructor is literally just flipping through these code books, basically reading them to us. And I remember sitting there and thinking to myself, oh my God, like there's gotta be a better way to do this.

Like my poor instructor is probably just, the bearer of the resources that were available at the time, which wasn't much. But I thought, oh my gosh, this is a great business model because she probably gets a good amount of cash from each student. She just does this in the evening.

She takes on, and she has this, I'm like, this looks like a cool bit. Like I would wanna do this at some point, but I think in a different sort of vibe. So as I progressed through my career, I started making little steps towards that. I would speak at local chapters. We have local coding chapters all across, basically the globe, I think at this point, but a lot in the United States, of course.

So I would start speaking at the local chapters. I started volunteering more. I started publishing some articles, getting additional certifications, speaking at national conventions. And then I'm like, you know what? Now that I have enough experience, oh, and teaching at a tech school, I did that for a stint too.

And after I'd done it for a while, I'm like, okay, now I'm ready to start producing my own videos. So I had no sooner purchased a house with an extra third bedroom. I'm like, I'm gonna set this up. It'll be my home office. I can start doing some remote work there. And then also when I'm done with my remote work, I can switch over and start recording some stuff to put on YouTube.

That was, Let's see. I think April of 2020, I would say. And yeah, it was about two weeks after I had gotten settled in with everything there when lockdown hit, and of course lockdown hit and then everyone thought to themselves, oh what's a career I can work for at home? Because we're all in lockdown.

What's a good remote job? And then they go onto YouTube and they're like, oh, medical coding, here's this girl Victoria. And it just blew up from there.

That's exactly how I found you. We started moving our business to more remote work in 2020. And many of my staff were talking about expanding our medical billing.

And that's exactly how I found you. So COVID and our business grew three times over COVID. It's so funny that, that event shifted, not just the workforce, but some of the business models that existed at that time. And some of them really benefited and some of them didn't.

But I noticed that our clients were moving away from the office, and so we got a lot of new business because we were already remote. But that's a great story. I had no idea that you you went that was your journey. So you've made your way from being the medical coding professional, speaking to chapters and conferences, gaining your following, and now you're on YouTube and you have these online followers. Who's your favorite audience member? Who's the person that you're the best fit for, and what do you love doing for them?

There's been this issue in my industry for a long time they used to have these advertisements and magazines, and I think they might even still, where you're, flipping through Cosmopolitan or women today or whatever.

And there's this little ad that says you can become a medical biller and coder and work from home and you won't have to pay for childcare and it'll, you can just do this in a couple of months and you'll be ready to go. And I always hated those magazine articles because it seemed like this was just like a throwaway job, that you could just take this quick correspondence course and be done with it.

And as much as I would love to say, yeah, you can do medical coding from home and take care of a toddler at the same time, it's really not realistic. So there's been a huge surge, and I've even personally known a handful of women that got into medical billing and coding cuz they thought that they would be able to just easily find this work from home job and watch their kids at the same time. But because there's just so much accuracy, so much productivity, like you would be setting yourself up for huge failure if you attempted to take care of young children and meet those standards at the same time.

And there are a lot of companies out there that have regulations around that, that they'll say, Hey, you can have kids in the house, but someone else has to be watching them, not you.

We need you to focus on the job that we're paying you an hourly fee to do. Absolutely. So yeah, I, I love, my, my kind of avatar, the person that I'm speaking to when I think about my YouTube channel is those people that you know moms, single moms. Moms that have been working as caregivers for years.

Maybe now their kid is starting elementary school and they're like, Hey, I kind of wanna get back into the workforce. They're researching, work from home jobs, they're researching things that they can do and they're like, they land on medical coding and then they find me and I can go, okay so here's the things that you need to know.

Again, not trying to. Squash anyone down and tell you this is not the right career fit for you. But you have to have a realistic look at what this is going to be. Some employers are gonna be okay with saying, yeah, you could stop and drop off your kids at the car line and drop them off and kiss them goodbye for school today.

And then, pick them up and have a couple finish your day a little bit later. Some of them are fine with that, but it might be harder to find those places that are able to do that. So you have to be prepared mentally for that. But that's who I love. I love the people that are looking for that first job after they've been taking care of their kids or they're looking for that career switch.

They've been working, floating from retail job to retail job. And they're like, oh, I just want something a little bit more specialized. And they land on medical coding, and they wanna contribute to healthcare. They're certainly not afraid of learning those new job skills and staying up to date on that, cuz you know, things change so much.

But that they're excited about getting into learning that new skillset. I love that. And I was gonna ask you that question. You already started answering it. What are the transferrable careers or where is there any what are the skillsets that are really necessary? How do we make this profession more digestible for somebody who didn't spend the last 10 years in medical billing and coding and what careers are easily, something that transfers into this. I think there's transferable skills in just about any career. You can always think of something, even if you're someone who can say, oh I made sure I followed the company policies.

I was aware of them. I didn't violate privacy regulations with our Customers base. I think basically anyone could really get into medical coding. Obviously it's gonna be beneficial if you have some healthcare experience. I've had people that say, I've worked in e m s for a number of years and now I'm tired of being patient facing.

And I, and would medical coding be a career, a good career fit for me? Yeah. Cuz you already know a little bit about. Medical terms, medical insurance just patient flow and as frustrating it as it is, a lot of times coders when they get certified in coding, they wanna work as coders. A lot of us have to find some kind of foot in the door type of job that maybe your title isn't medical coder, but you deal with medical codes.

So even if that's like registration, okay. You know how to use those electronic medical record systems. The different types of providers that are out. There, again, patient flow, just having those little skills in there. Good. So if you have any kind of career that has any kind of touching of working with scheduling systems or even with medical records of any sort always a benefit.

I was gonna say medical scheduling might be a good foot in the door for most people. They could get, on the ground floor setting appointments and following up on patients while they're studying for coding and billing. Yeah. Or even prior authorizations, making those phone calls to the insurance companies going, Hey, this is the procedure, these are the codes.

Is this something that you pay for? And getting all that information together.

Absolutely. That's a great stepping stone. And I, that kind of leads me to my next question, which is when someone says coding is overwhelming, I don't, there's so much to learn. Where, how do you respond to somebody who says, there's just too much to learn?

One of the great things about medical coding is that. In medical coding, you don't always have to know the answers. You just need to know where to find the answers. You don't have to memorize the codes, you don't have to memorize the loca the regulations or the laws or anything like that. You just at least need to have a familiarity with them that when.

For example, I, off the top of my head, couldn't rattle off all of the different coding guidelines for sepsis, but I know where they are in the book. So if I'm coding something for sepsis and I'm like, oh my gosh, what are the regulations? I know where to go to the guideline and look it up so I can sequence it properly, make sure I'm assigning the correct code.

So it's not about all of that. Although it was very funny when I used to teach at the tech school. I would always, in every class have someone that would raise their hand and go, excuse me. When we're doing the coding and we're taking our tests, do we have to have all of these codes memorized in the book?

And I of course would always go unfortunately, yes, you do have to memorize all of the codes in the book just to mess with them a little bit no, of course not. It's an open book test. You're allowed to look at the codes. We're not gonna expect you to memorize tens of thousands of different medical codes as you progress.

There will be some that you might know off the top of your head. Pretty much everyone knows that hypertension is I 10, and that the E 11 codes or the diabetes codes, the commonly used ones, you'll start getting familiar with, but you are not expected to know everything off of the top of your head.

And that's one of the things that we're talking to our staff about is not only that, but also specializing in a specific medical industry and starting off with something like chiropractic or dermatology, something that has fewer than a thousand codes. You can get your foot in the door with just using the same 50 of them for the first three or four months. Do you have students that generally want to start in a smaller industry before they tackle hospital work?

I do, and it's funny because sometimes people have like very niche things. Like I've seen quite a few people recently that are like, oh, I just wanna get into mental health coding. And I'm like, that's great. You can get into mental health coding. But I would start with a good foundational base cuz you wanna have a good foundation of knowing a little bit of everything because if you're just looking for mental health jobs right out of the gate when you're just starting out in this career we're narrowing our field now of the jobs that we wanna apply for.

And that's gonna be tough. So you might wanna have to start somewhere else, maybe working in family practice or general surgery. And if your goal is mental health, yeah, start getting in some additional training in that and working towards maybe making that transition. But don't narrow your focus so much that you're like, oh, I'm only ever gonna work in this specialty.

That's a good, that's a good advice. We actually started our service offering with only serving a certain niche and we've expanded, but as a business, when we're targeting a specific demographic for us, that was appropriate. But as a, as somebody who's learning, coding and billing as a technician don't be afraid to branch out and learn.

More than one industry. I think that's great advice. On the topic of the complexity of billing and coding the question comes up with my team. Why can, especially somebody who's brand new, why are these so complicated? And I've made the comment before on this show, I don't know if you saw it, but I said the evil insurance companies and their shareholders that's why it's so complicated.

Is that a contrarian view and what's the what? What do you think about that statement that you have to, providers have to love what they do. They have to really be humanitarians to get into this because it's not a business that is easy to get into and it's difficult to get paid sometimes.

And I made the, I don't know if it was a joke, but I just made the comment that insurance companies want to require the most from the patient and give out the lease to the provider, and they're gonna benefit in the exchange. What is your, you've worked with insurance companies and you've had to deal with this complexity.

What is your take on that?

Yeah, it's tough because I try to be non-biased in these sort of situations. Like I understand the insurance company is a business and they do have to make money, maybe not to the point that the c e o is making billions of dollars a year and that they're not undercutting patients.

They only have so much money that they have to. Have out of their pool of money to contribute to all of these patients illnesses and sicknesses. And as much as we would love to say, yeah, you should just pay for everything all the time. If I want a nose job, my insurance should pay for that.

They would run out of money and go out of business. You try to be like, okay, they, but then we also have these situations where, which recently happened like with Cigna, where Cigna had said that Oh, it was in the news that they had developed these algorithms that would the denials would go to the physicians.

The physicians would look at them and based off of the algorithm, they'd click a button and they'd submit, hundreds of denials through these cases that were supposed to be physician reviewed within just a click of a button, just 50 denials would go out. And it's tough to balance that. I think we're seeing now though a lot more with the social media and even things like TikTok, a lot more insurances are being held accountable for some of their crappy practices.

Recently, Cigna wanted to have documentation for all of their office visits that were billed out with a 25 modifier. So if you're not familiar when. You do a procedure on the same day as an office visit the insurance wants to know that these were two separate things. That it wasn't, that office visit was entirely related to what was going on in the procedure.

So you slap on this 25 modifier to signify to them, oh yeah, here was this office visit. We treated, let's say the patient's. Chronic conditions with that. They have diabetes, hypertension, et cetera, 25 modifier to let them know there was a separate procedure. Maybe they had that, their flu shot, cuz it's flu shot season and they're like, Hey, you're in for your visit while you're here.

Let's get your flu shot for you. So signifying to them, these are two separate things. Cigna said, oh we want documentation for all of that because we, there is a, there's a historical problem with it. And they received so much pushback from the specialty societies, from the consumers, from the patient, from the providers, from the American Medical Association that they dialed it back and said, you know what, maybe we'll just delay that again and we'll revisit that again and you.

We know we, those of us that are in the industry know it's because they received so much heat about it. So I think, while we have to understand that these are businesses, we do have to do better to hold them accountable when they are putting policies together that are just completely unfair to the consumer.

Absolutely. And in this, it's a relationship between the provider and the insurance company and the patient. And it's a delicate balance. And if they don't balance that correctly people will either stop, getting credentialed with them or patients will stop ensuring themselves with them. But what made me really frustrated was there was over a hundred million that was uncollected, and I don't have the link, but it was either a billion or a million, but it was, no matter what it was a hundred million or a hundred billion, but it was uncollected revenue for the providers just because of the.

The nature of the billing, it was either undercoded or it was denied and not followed up with. And the effort sometimes in a small practice is I can go see a patient right now and. It's almost like it's not worth the chase. And that breaks my heart because it is worth it because we need to keep them accountable to what they promised us.

And even if we lose money in the transaction because you're paying the employee $15 an hour and it takes them four hours to get the a hundred dollars benefit back it, that can be deflating to some of our providers. And so we're trying to work out ways to make it a win when we're doing their building.

Oh, absolutely. And that was some of the feedback I was even hearing with the Cigna situation, that people were saying, you know what, if the insurances are gonna not pay for the procedure, or they're not gonna pay a, they're gonna pay a reduced fee, then maybe we will only bill whichever one is the higher amount and then not even bill for the services that you did. That's ridiculous.

I want providers to get paid. For every single penny, for every service that they provided. I don't want them to get paid extra because then of course that would be, incorrect and they'd have to have paybacks and then they'd probably get penalties for the paybacks, et cetera. But you should still go after, be able to do, you should still feel comfortable going after the dollars for the services that you provided.

Yeah, and even the, like I said, the trade off of the time that you. Sometimes we're just billing on principle, not necessarily because it's going to be a huge profit gain on this one, claim.

So what would you moving, talking about small practices, where do you sit on the spectrum of outsourced in-house? And when do you think it's appropriate to start small? Bring someone in, get them trained. And then when do you think the outsourcing makes sense? We're talking to a lot of small practices and clinics and maybe they bring in somebody very green to help them start the clinic and get started.

But then they've grown and they've really outgrown that first coder or biller.

Yeah. And I think that's always great to give someone an opportunity, but I think if you're someone who has a private practice, you wanna have an inside coder and they're a dedicated, coder, biller, maybe they help scheduling or some other factors.

Yeah, that's great. As long as you are committed to making sure that they are doing things correctly. That they are doing things like getting their certifications in medical coding. Where I think I've seen some issues in the past is, Will have a provider that maybe just has their practice manager do the billing, and I've had independent practices.

Their practice manager has done the billing. They've maybe even corrected the documentation for the provider. Now they get bought up by the hospital and I'm sitting there working for the hospital, looking at this going, how have you gotten paid for anything because your documentation isn't. Up to snuff.

This doesn't look like I get that you got paid, but you shouldn't have. Because what was documented here isn't supporting what you've been billing out. And running into huge issues there. Wow. So I think finding that internal right fit person is great. But when you're just handing it off to someone who maybe doesn't have the full understanding of everything and has.

Has that personal relationship with the provider that maybe they'll just go, oh, I don't wanna bother them. I'm just gonna make this and fix this and do things that aren't technically compliant. That's where we run into issues. And I think in those situations, or as you're scaling, it's better to.

Outsource to a billing company that has that staff of people that are certified coders. They've worked these specialties before. They know the guidelines, they know the regulations and they're a little bit better suited to make sure that things are done in accordance with the federal regulations.

And that, that you won't have to be surprised when that audit letter comes in from a health insurance and they're saying, Hey, we think that you've been billing incorrectly. We want all of these records. And the next thing you're having to cut them a big, fat check to refund them. Yeah I think outsourcing isn't an issue.

Especially for me as a medical coder, I always tell people, the outsourcing doesn't necessarily eliminate the job, it just moves the seat somewhere else. And I think there's a big difference between offshoring versus outsourcing that sometimes people don't understand.

People think outsourcing and offshoring are the same thing. Outsourcing just means that there's a different company doing. But offshoring is when we move it to a different country, which then that comes into, safety regulations. If you or I take a celebrity's medical record and share it with people on the internet, the feds are gonna come knocking on our door because of hipaa and we're gonna get dragged and we'll never be able to work in this industry again.

If someone who's in another country. Shares a celebrity's medical record. HIPAA is a federal law. Does it apply over there? Is there gonna be stipulations for it? No that's where we come into some questioning there. So outsourcing, I have no problem with offshoring, a little concern there.

Yeah. And one of the things I've talked to our practice owners about is that it's not necessarily that, let's say outsourcing could be done either more efficiently or cheaper. That's really not the reason. Sometimes it's, You don't have an internal revenue manager who can really hold that coder or that biller accountable.

And so sometimes what we're doing as a service is we're pooling our resources, we're pulling them together because it wouldn't make sense for a small practice to have a, an expert revenue manager on staff, but sometimes that oversight is necessary. Even though maybe dollar for dollar, you're spending the same amount of money on the billing and the coding.


So I talk to our providers about making sure that we are staying up to speed and up to date on the changes in the industry. We know that FinTech is making a big impact in the way patients pay their bill, and I know that I'm more inclined on the billing side and less on the coding side.

But everything works together. It's the whole revenue cycle. Where do you see the industry going in the next 10 years, and how do you as an educator prepare for your next students or your students that come back to you for recertification. What are some things you're seeing that you're preparing for?

Yeah, so we're seeing a lot more transition of various electronical tools. In the past we've had paper books and people love their paper books. I love my paper books. But now it's not cost effective to have the paper books anymore. For our, for the, from the standpoint of these employers, because they either would have to order.

Hundred books for all of their coders, have them shipped centrally and then individually ship out a hundred sets of books and they come at different times of the year. Or they're gonna have to individually ship out all of these books to these individual people. They would rather give them an e-book.

They would rather have them use electronic tools that they can access online that they could even share between a team of people. So we're seeing a huge transition now of. Moving away from these paper tools and moving into electronic books, electronic searches, using what we call encoders, which some of them, they're just more of a search tool where you can just type in what kind of procedure you did and it'll give you a listing.

Some of them are very savvy where you might. Type in something like gallbladder. Okay, what did you do with the gallbladder? Did you excise it? Did you do a biopsy? Did you do a scan of the bl bladder, a gallbladder? And then it'll help lead you to what is a likely code for it. And of course now we're starting to see AI technology coming into play.

I don't think that's going to happen as fast as people may predict it will. I've talked to some of these AI vendors and even as they discuss like the programming of it, if you think about how the AI has to work, In order for it to. Read a document and pick the code out. Each individual code basically has to have a series of questions around it.

If this, then this, if not, then this, if it says, so to do that for the tens of thousands of codes is no small undertaking. And then having the experts that have to review this, and then, one person commented to me that their provider's initials were DM and the AI technology.

Every time it saw DM tried to code the patients with diabetes Melitis because it couldn't differentiate that was the provider's initials, not a diagnosis that was on the documentation. So I think this is a great tool. We're seeing so much consumption of healthcare that we need the assistance.

There's just so much going on. Guidelines, regulations, changing that the medical coding. Profession is going to need assistance of AI in order to make sure that we're doing things efficiently. And I think there will be a transition maybe in the next maybe five to 10 years where we see some of the more entry level coding tasks being taken off of our plates and us transitioning into more of a quality assurance and odd thing type of role.

So that's where I see us transitioning. And again, I, when I think about people saying, oh yeah, the ai, cuz I've, I have trolls that'll come onto my channel and they'll say, oh, your job's gonna be gone in six months. I'm like, okay, we're still using fax machines, so I don't know that healthcare is going to adapt to this technology.

Quite as fast as maybe you think it's going to. I think we will get there. But it's going to take a long time. And it's like the automated car, you always have to keep your hands on the steering wheel. You can't just let the AI code everything.

It's Yeah, it's not abdication. We are leveraging maybe some efficiencies that we're gonna get out of ai and like you said you can search for.

You can get somebody to help you search. I say somebody, you can get the AI to help you arrive at conclusions faster. But it certainly can't replace what we're doing yet. The healthcare industry is like a big cruise ship. It takes a while to turn and you have to Improve while you're continuing to go.

You, you're, we're not building this from the ground up. We are, we have a hundred years of technology that we have to consider when we introduce AI to help us make changes in the in, in the industry. But what I've told my team is that the AI's gonna help. A competent person, be a little bit more efficient and make fewer mistakes and catch things.

But we cannot depend on our careers for, we can never blame AI for something that we didn't do right. So the responsibility is still a human human part of this equation. I wanna go back to, I wanna go back and talk to the audience that you're looking for and some of the audience members that we might share in common.

What are your, some of your favorite resources when somebody wants to advance their skills in coding, advance their skills in billing, and let's say they're, Not just job shopping, but also wanting to expand their knowledge. We know there's the A P C, the A M B A and the M A B. Do you use these resources constantly or are there other ones that you love better?

Yeah. First step, if someone's interested in getting into a career in medical billing and coding and they need training, they can go to And that's the free career masterclass that I put together where I could talk about salary expectations, what the job is like, and my recommendation for the best program out there.

If you're someone who wants to get trained in this, as far as how. I like to stay up to snuff on things. I am, I'm a big advocate for A P C and their local chapters. I think most employers now are looking for certifications through A P C or a hema, the American Health Information Management Association.

I personally like the A P C. It's easier to start in, it's not quite as confusing and there's a great support. So the A E P C has so many local chapters that you can network with people. You can find people in there for every specialty under the sun. They'll help you get your continuing education units as a coder.

And of course I have programs as well if you need continuing education units, if you want to get certified in like risk adjustment coding or as an auditor, I do have programs available on for that. But I follow Sonal Patel she has a podcast called Paint the Medical Picture, which is great for current trends and things going on in the auditing industry in compliance, hot news interviews. She's great.

And then there's Sean Weiss, who is the compliance guy, and he has several broadcasts that he does right now where he talks about compliance issues, fraud alerts and has a great team that he brings on every, I believe Monday to discuss some of the current trends that I really enjoy doing that.

But yeah, and of course there's great people out there like me on YouTube that, that provide all kinds of career advice and tips and case studies and things. But yeah, I think as a general statement, just getting connected to your A P C network is a great way to get. Get connected with the resources that you're gonna need.

And I think it's totally appropriate that you put yourself on the list. You do provide so much value for this community. So last question. What are your future plans and what's coming next for your audience in the way of your courses? Or what content should they be expecting? I wanna make sure that we give them the resources. They can find you on the, if they're not following you yet, they need to know how to find you on YouTube what courses you're offering and how they can engage with you.

Yeah, so I am on basically all of the social media platforms as Contempo coding. You'd find me on YouTube under Contempo coding, TikTok, Instagram, and my YouTube channel is the core of it all. So I continually growing that channel building videos that are helpful for the industry. Beginner stuff, case studies. I personally have some courses on risk adjustment coding, which is all diagnosis based.

I have the prep for the certification for those. I have prep for auditing. I have some continuing education courses on there as well. Right now I'm doing some secret squirrel stuff, so I'm working on some just general medical coding resources that I'm hoping to release next year. And of, and with me I like to have things a little bit more visual, so working on more supplementary information than, the entire 1 0 1 medical coding.

And yeah, excited about that. And that's gonna be a big focus of mine is making some supplemental materials over the next year.

So we have the links to Victoria's Resources in the show notes. Visit her on YouTube Contempo coding. The best email to contact Victoria is

Is there anything else you'd like to say to your audience before we end the show?

Yeah, definitely head over to the YouTube channel and sign up. Make sure you subscribe, hit the alert button because I post all kinds of new episodes every week and have been doing a lot of more short form content as well. If you need a good laugh though, you definitely wanna follow me on TikTok, cuz that's where I post all my funny content.

I can't wait! Alright, Victoria, thank you so much and make it a great day. This is Adam and Victoria on the Better Billing Today Podcast. That's our show. Thank you, Victoria for joining us on this episode.

If you want more of her resources, take a look at the show notes. All of her resources are listed there to contact us. We're at and you can find this episode on all of your favorite platforms at Have a great day.

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